Subject: The hackers.org.il Domain

From: Shlomi Fish <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 11:29:58 +0200

Hi all!

I'd like to discuss what policy we set for the hackers.org.il domain. Possible 
things we can do with it are:

1. provide domain names for members (arikb.hackers.org.il, 
mulix.hackers.org.il, etc.) in case someone wants them.

2. Provide mail accounts (shlomif(at)hackers.org.il, oleg(at)hackers.org.il), 
etc.

3. Provide homepages at www.hackers.org.il/~omerz/, www.hackers.org.il/~nadav/
(may be a bit problematic because they have to be on the same server).

4. Anything else?

I, on my part, would very much like a shlomif.hackers.org.il domain name, 
because at the moment shlomif.il.eu.org causes a great deal of problems. The 
question is naturally, if anyone feels such services are an abuse of the 
domain name. 

So, voice your opinion.

Regards,

	Shlomi Fish
-- 

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Shlomi Fish      [email-masked]
Homepage:        http://shlomif.il.eu.org/

Knuth is not God! It took him two days to build the Roman Empire.

---

From: Gabor Szabo <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 12:11:30 +0200 (IST)

> question is naturally, if anyone feels such services are an abuse of the

Without any opinion on the other suggestions, AFAIK the best would
be for you is to register www.shlomifish.com and use that on some server.

Gabor

---

From: Omer Zak <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 01 Oct 2004 12:34:37 +0200

DISCLAIMER:
It is easy for me to express this opinion, because I already have my own 
registered domain name (zak.co.il).

Given the disclaimer my opinion is as follows:

0. Do not give people subdomains of hackers.org.il.  Too much 
opportunities for abuse, and besides, nowadays, getting a domain name is 
not that prohibitively expensive.

1. If, however, members are to get subdomain names for Web sites (for 
example, because we want to help people, who cannot afford to pay $60 
for their own domain name registration) - then only under the following 
limitations:
- as a sub-subdomain name (such as www.shlomif.members.hackers.org.il)
- no commercial use
(If you can make money from a domain, you can pay for it, and then thou 
shalt registerth it yourselfth.)
- After making very sure that a disclaimer that Hackers-IL (as an 
organization) has dictatorical authority and zero responsibility over 
what members are doing in their *.members.hackers.org.il domains.

2. Members are to arrange for their own hosting deals, and then ask the 
owner of members.hackers.org.il to point their sub-subdomain name at 
their arranged host.  Investigate feasibility of using a system like 
dyndns to allow people to use their home computers as their own Web 
hosts even if they do not have fixed IP address.  This will give them 
another option for trade-off between bandwidth and web hosting costs.

3. Any disk space on computers under public control is to be devoted for 
public stuff, such as mirrors of distributions, additional Free Software 
source code packages, archives of relevant mailing lists and forum 
discussions.

> question is naturally, if anyone feels such services are an abuse of the 

                                              --- Omer
My own blog is at http://www.livejournal.com/users/tddpirate/

My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
I may be affiliated in any way.
WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html

---

From: Arik Baratz <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 12:55:22 +0200

> what members are doing in their *.members.hackers.org.il domains.

I don't think the intension is to help poor fellas that can't afford
their own domain. I think the intention is to have a cool hostname!

I am for giving a free <your-name>.hackers.org.il to any hackers-il
member who wishes it - provided he submits his real (verified) email
address, real (verified) phone number and real home physical address
in a database which will be prepared for this purpose, and given to
law enforcement in case they ask for it and provide a warrent, or used
to forward take-down notices.

> another option for trade-off between bandwidth and web hosting costs.

I agree. Without this people will just sign up to have free web-hosting.

> source code packages, archives of relevant mailing lists and forum

Agree.

-- Arik

---

From: "Tzahi Fadida" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 16:17:54 +0200

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Shlomi Fish [mailto:[email-masked]] 
> Sent: Friday, October 01, 2004 11:30 AM
> To: Hackers-IL
> Subject: [hackers-il] The hackers.org.il Domain
> 
> 
> Hi all!
> 

Yeah, cool! btw, where is the computer hosted?

> 2. Provide mail accounts (shlomif(at)hackers.org.il, 

yeah, again very cool. although I'll bet you'll get spam filtered half the
time
because of the name hacker. (stupid but true)
also, I learned that if you want to rely on email you have to consider the
hosting.

> 
> 3. Provide homepages at www.hackers.org.il/~omerz/, 
> www.hackers.org.il/~nadav/ (may be a bit problematic because 
> they have to be on the same server).
> 

if you already giving tzahi.hackers.org.il, why not give virtual hosts and
be done with it.
i.e. tzahi.hackers.org.il mulix.hackers.org.il etc on the same
server(hopefully) without 
too much hassle, no need for more ips, etc...
give ftp access only and for the time being only allow html processing. i.e.
no server scripting.
even more, allow only for personal pages.

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---

From: Muli Ben-Yehuda <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 16:30:31 +0200

> mulix.hackers.org.il, etc.) in case someone wants them.

Who owns hackers.org.il? this endless discussion you keep instigating
is quite boring. Let the person who owns it do with it as they please.

Cheers, 
Muli
-- 
Muli Ben-Yehuda
http://www.mulix.org | http://mulix.livejournal.com/

---

From: Adir Abraham <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 18:22:44 +0200 (IST)

> is quite boring. Let the person who owns it do with it as they please.

It is arikb who owns it.

	Adir.

---

From: Arik Baratz <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 18:29:41 +0200

> is quite boring. Let the person who owns it do with it as they please.

I own it. I participate in the discussion. Hence, this discussion is relevant.

-- Arik

---

From: Gadi Evron <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 02 Oct 2004 03:10:32 +0200

> I own it. I participate in the discussion. Hence, this discussion is relevant.

No it isn't, you can do with it as you please. Is this going to become a 
status symbol to some members, an open service to any new member, or 
whatever else? Just do with it what *you* want. If anyone wants one, 
email Arik.

I stand by all the above except if the domain was registered as an 
hackers-il domain, in which case, let's just be elite snobs and deny 
ourselves the questionable pleasure? :)

I don't really see why a discussion of publicly used private property is 
a good use of Yahoo!'s bandwidth. Allow me to contribute some more 
though. Take that, Yahoo!:
bksgbfbgd\
hghfgsgb
ihnv ecreh[ougae
;iauhfw;bwrj

:o)

	Gadi.

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Fri, 01 Oct 2004 20:25:07 +0200

> because at the moment shlomif.il.eu.org causes a great deal of problems. The 

What kind of problems (feel free to reply off-list if it's not a proper
topic).

Cheers,

--Amos

---

From: Shlomi Fish <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2004 12:35:20 +0200

> What kind of problems (feel free to reply off-list if it's not a proper

Well, just to inform everybody else:

eu.org gives free domain names (under the .eu.org domain) to organizations and 
invidiuals. il.eu.org is one of the domains dedicated to Israeli sub-domains. 
Now, I registered a domain there to serve as the domain for my home-site. 
(what used to be http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/). However, there are a 
few problems:

1. It seems the machine hosting the master eu.org domain causes some problems 
in its DNS lookup.

2. il.eu.org is hosted at the Technion's network, which is itself error-prone.

As a result many people report the hostname to be unresolvable. This is a bit 
strange since linuxclub.il.eu.org seems to resolve for everybody. It seems 
that in Israel, it is mostly OK by now. However, outside Israel, it seems to 
depend on planetary arrangement. Google seems to be OK with it:

http://www.google.com/search?q=shlomi+fish&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

(check the third link)

And also other people I've asked, but others have reported problems.

I realize that I shouldn't look a gift horse by his teeth, but it is still 
frustrating.

Regards,

	Shlomi Fish

--

---

From: Arik Baratz <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2004 12:32:48 +0200

> whatever else? Just do with it what *you* want. If anyone wants one,

Gadi,

I have long since claimed that I bought it as a contribution to this
group. I own it, because Hackers-IL can't own stuff. I will do with it
what we decide, in this forum.

So it is.

> ourselves the questionable pleasure? :)

Oh for crying out loud. Why can't you let us geeks be geeks?

> a good use of Yahoo!'s bandwidth. Allow me to contribute some more

...because it is a public discussion, about a privately owned
property, where the owner pledged his willingness to do with this
property for the good of the abovementioned public.

-- Arik

---

From: "Nadav Har'El" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 11:40:02 +0200

> mulix.hackers.org.il, etc.) in case someone wants them.

This decision should be entirely with the person who is giving hackers.org.il
DNS service. After all, this simply puts more strain on his DNS server, and
also requires his cooperation for actually updating the DNS.

If this person (who is he?) agrees, than I don't see a reason why.

> 2. Provide mail accounts (shlomif(at)hackers.org.il, oleg(at)hackers.org.il), 

Mail forwarding or pop3?

In any case, this requires resources (time and bandwidth) from the person
who owns the machine to which the MX or hackers.org.il points to. Again,
we should ask this person.

-- 
Nadav Har'El                        |       Sunday, Oct 3 2004, 18 Tishri 5765
[email-masked]             |-----------------------------------------
Phone +972-523-790466, ICQ 13349191 |A professor is one who talks in someone
http://nadav.harel.org.il           |else's sleep.

---

From: Arik Baratz <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 12:13:16 +0200

> If this person (who is he?) agrees, than I don't see a reason why.

I'm hosting the domain in xname.org, which supply this service for
free. I donated some money, if everyone here donates $5 it can really
help them. It's up to you.

> we should ask this person.

I'm willing to redirect the MXs to any host which owner claims will do
either. It's currently pointed at vipe.technion.ac.il

-- Arik

---

From: Elad Efrat <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 18:44:57 +0200 (IST)

this has to be one of THE gayest things ever discussed on this list.

shlomi, i have to say that you are a fucking retard for asking to
start a public service just because YOU have dns problems and cant
stablize on something on your own. if you want to start spamming
sites with [email-masked] as email address and look like the
faggot you are, be my guest, but dont spam this mailing list.

ARIK BARATZ ATA KAZE HACKER FOR OWNING HACKERS.ORG.IL CAN I JOIN
YOUR CREW@?#$#??!

please make a new mailing lists for such discussions. you are polluting
my list with linux questions, rfc's about meetings (FOR FUCKS SAKE)
and new website designs and A PUBLIC SUGGESTION TO GIVE SUBDOMAINS AND
EMAIL ADDRESSES ON HACKERS.ORG.IL WHERE THE FUCK IS THIS GOING WHAT
ELSE IS GOING TO HAPPEN HERE?

i really am speechless at this new discussion. i ask all you retards
and linux-il rejects out there to take your discussions to where they
fit and title them properly. I DO NOT WANT TO HEAR ABOUT FEDORA, LINUX
INSTALLATION PROBLEMS, WHAT PACKAGING SYSTEM IS BETTER, etc.

GET A LIFE!

IM SERIOUS ABOUT THAT GET A LIFE!

and i hate russians btw

fuck you're some gay nerds.

---

From: "Tzahi Fadida" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 19:01:04 +0200

Is it possible to kick this guy from the list? I think several lines have
been
crossed here.

> From: Elad Efrat [mailto:[email-masked]] 
> Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 6:45 PM
> To: Hackers-IL
> Subject: Re: [hackers-il] The hackers.org.il Domain

---

From: Arik Baratz <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 19:50:43 +0200

> Is it possible to kick this guy from the list? I think several lines have

Don't feed the trolls.

-- Arik

---

From: Shlomi Fish <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 20:02:45 +0200

> this has to be one of THE gayest things ever discussed on this list.
[Unnecessary swearing snipped]

Will the mailing list's administrators please ban this "Elad 
Efrat" ([email-masked]) character from this respectable forum?

Here are the messages that he wrote so far:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/message/3903 (the one quoted here)

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/message/3803 (an attack of me)

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/message/3605

("and i thought you can't get any more gay")

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/message/3679

(another random swearing).

I had enough from him.

Regards,

	Shlomi Fish

--

---

From: Tal Rotbart <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 21:20:44 +0200

On Fri, 8 Oct 2004 20:02:45 +0200, Shlomi Fish <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> [Unnecessary nitpicking snipped]
> I had enough from him.

Then just like I suggested to him, please set up a filter to erase his
mail from your personal inbox.

>         Shlomi Fish

Regards,
- Tal R.

---

From: Orna Agmon <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 00:20:38 +0200 (IST)

> mail from your personal inbox.

Actually, this is different. Allowing the term "gay" as an undermining
title disrespects the people who tolerate hearing it, just as much as it
disrespects the person using it.

This is not about filtering one's private mailbox, but about creating a
non-hostile environment for upto 10% of the population.

I believe anyone who uses this kind of language should be banned from the
mailing list, if indeed such an operation is possible.

Orna.
--
Orna Agmon http://vipe.stud.technion.ac.il/~ladypine/
ICQ: 348759096

---

From: Arik Baratz <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 04:52:22 +0200

This thread is just troll-food. Stop it, please!

-- Arik